https://bit.ly/3Epm4Lv https://bit.ly/3ErsOZG https://bit.ly/3qj63lt https://bit.ly/3mqvBfw https://bit.ly/3mryVH8 https://bit.ly/30P4B1p https://bit.ly/32rLE5g https://bit.ly/3sqrgMY I'm puzzled by how these two things are supposed to go together. They seem to me be the opposite of each other. Being Taken In Hand is, I thought about wanting to have a man in control, whereas a rapist is a man who has no control at all, he can't restrain himself, but just succumbs to his violent passion. Do out-of-control men appeal to women so much? There are two seperate things going on here. The man who takes his woman in hand is exerting control, over her and himself. That is why he is admirable because he controls himself enough to be qualified to control her. I mean, if he was an immature brat who succumbed to all his desires and had no self control, why would anyone want to submit to him? This doesn't mean that he is not capable of losing control but that he is capable of controlling himself. So the rape/ravishment fantasy, when acted out, shows the woman just how out of control the man can be, just what the possibilities are and what it is that he subdues to protect her normally. It also shows that, though he is so good at controlling himself normally, desire for her is so great in him and that, provided she is willing, he has to let it out sometimes. The other part of the turn on is knowing that he only expresses it because she desires it. If it scared her, if it did not turn her on, he would keep his control. So, though he appears to be out of control, he is still actually in control. That's how he keeps from hurting her. Louise, you have often said that one of the things that you like about your relationship now that you are Taken In Hand is that your husband controls his temper now. You know what it was like before and you are happy because he exerts control over himself as opposed to losing control as he did before. I think this is much the same thing, at least it is for me. This is one of the reasons why I tell my husband that, while I don't want him to hurt me, I like it if when I am yelling at him, he yells back at me, if he feels like it. It reminds me that when he does control himself, he is really exerting himself and that he is not just naturally calm and collected. There is actually some passion there. So, no, it's not about wanting a man who is out of his mind. I certainly don't want to go looking for Jeffrey Dahmer or John Wayne Gassey (sp?). It is about wanting a man who knows his mind and his own passions and knows when to control them and when to let them run and has the ability to do both. That's the turn on. The passion of the ravishment only serves to emphasize the control that he exercises in our day to day lives. What is admirable about a man keeping his control if he has no passion that needs controlling? otter*